I was one of the first people to make the joke ‘will the Lib Dems now ask for a second vote at Richmond Park as the people did not know what they were voting for’. However there is though a much more sinister undertone to what has happened post June 23rd. Joking apart, the newly elected MP for Richmond Sarah Olney has fervently and confidently stated that, should this go to Parliament, she will not vote for the invoking of article 50. The Labour leader Jeremy Corbyn has stated that they, the Labour Party would seek to attach amendments to the bill.
The attempts by people from all political sides to undermine and overturn the will of the people is actually taking a very dangerous path. The language now being used is aimed at confusing the electorate and slowly but surely turning them away from the issue so it becomes of little importance or, more worryingly could it be that these so called elite are aiming to simply dictate their political will on the country? I fear the latter.
The sheer arrogance and complacency of people like Nick Clegg, Tim Farron, Tony Blair and others is just staggering. I have never ever thought in favour of civil unrest to win an issue nor condoned behaviour which would lead to such trouble. But these people now wishing to muddy the waters are in their own way promulgating such unrest by the spoken word and their insistence that the electorate got it wrong.
Since the vote on June 23rd, the Remoaners have consistently taken a view that the economy is in free fall or that it will be. Doom and gloom is the constant prophecy and they insist on their rhetoric even in the face of lower unemployment, lower inflation and major companies such as Landrover, Google, Siemens and Nissan all committing to a long term investment in the country. The recent largest rise for a decade in consumer spending will not deter their determination to talk down this nation. They will not listen and have gained the upper hand so far in this war of words. This standpoint is largely supported by the mainstream media and they are a very powerful ally.
A further sinister unravelling of the vote to leave is the current court case before the Supreme Court. All eleven judges are sitting to hear the appeal but there is clearly for some, an enormous conflict of interest that cannot be ignored. One of the judges has openly said that the outcome of the referendum is “not legally binding”. There are further issues with members of this supremacy, such as the chairman of the court whose wife tweeted that the Brexit vote was “just a protest vote”. We await the outcome with baited breath.
The language of the “remain in the EU at any cost” cabal, is strong. They are gaining more and more confidence as political interrogator’s struggle to make sense of their view points. The more experienced agitators find it easy to confuse and conflate their message. One thing is clear though, they insist at all times that they agree that this country will leave the EU. However it is the way in which we leave that is their so called concern.
The single market has now become the biggest issue; it is bigger than immigration, the recent migration numbers, almost the highest on record, have largely been lost in the cacophony of noise about the single market. The government are not helping much, recent comments in Parliament by the Brexit Minister that we could consider paying sums of money to the EU to stay in the single market are a very worrying development. Given that we have a £70 billion deficit with the EU on trade surely common sense dictates that our stance should be just the opposite. Any watering down of the vote to leave will not be tolerated. Ministers and Remoaners should be reminded of this at every opportunity.
We the leave group have to be more vocal. We have to find a champion, someone to step up to the plate and talk the talk. Someone who will have the political credence to be heard and understood. That person should be Paul Nuttall the new leader of Ukip. There has of course, since his election, been a concerted effort to undermine and ruin his name by the press. He has in true Ukip style ridden out the nonsense put to him in the form of disturbing and untruthful allegations. He has answered all questions with an honesty so often not available from other political operators.
Peter Whittle, his deputy leader, is a strong performer and a straight talker and very credible when defending the 17.4 million who voted to leave the EU. One note of concern is the appearance by members of the Ukip Hierarchy on shows such as Have I Got News For You and the political show, This Week. These productions have one agenda and that is to ridicule, they should be given a very wide berth.
We thought the war was won, clearly that was a mistake. It was the first in a very long line of battles yet to be fought. We cannot rest, we cannot sit back and watch the will of the people be overturned and more importantly ignored.
I for one was hoping that the single issue of the EU would be a part player now in putting to the country the 2015 Manifesto of UKip. I thought we were in a very great need to get our message out there, to prove to the electorate that we are a serious party with a serious plan for the country. I for now though think we should again put our party and its aims to one side to ensure that we represent the people who voted for leave on the 23rd. For sure no one else will.
Photo by johnsons531 
Here is a list of prime targets for UKIP (thanks to the DE for publishing it):
CONSERVATIVE – 1
Ken Clarke (Rushcliffe)
LABOUR – 23
Rushanara Ali (Bethnal Green and Bow)
Graham Allen (Nottingham North)
Ben Bradshaw (Exeter)
Ann Coffey (Stockport)
Neil Coyle (Bermondsey and Old Southwark)
Stella Creasy (Walthamstow)
Geraint Davies (Swansea West)
Jim Dowd (Lewisham West and Penge)
Louise Ellman (Liverpool Riverside)
Chris Evans (Islwyn)
Paul Farrelly (Newcastle-under-Lyme)
Mike Gapes (Ilford South)
Helen Hayes (Dulwich and West Norwood)
Meg Hillier (Hackney South and Shoreditch)
Peter Kyle (Hove)
David Lammy (Tottenham)
Chris Leslie (Nottingham East)
Ian Murray (Edinburgh South)
Barry Sheerman (Huddersfield)
Tulip Siddiq (Hampstead and Kilburn)
Angela Smith (Penistone and Stocksbridge)
Catherine West (Hornsey and Wood Green)
Daniel Zeichner (Cambridge)
LIBERAL DEMOCRAT – 5
Alistair Carmichael (Orkney and Shetland)
Nick Clegg (Sheffield Hallam)
Tim Farron (Westmorland and Lonsdale)
Sarah Olney (Richmond Park)
Mark Williams (Ceredigion)
GREEN PARTY – 1
Caroline Lucas (Brighton Pavilion)
SDLP – 3
Mark Durkam (Foyle)
Alasdair McDonnell (Belfast South)
Margaret Ritchie (South Down)
INDEPENDENT – 2
Natalie McGarry (Glasgow East)
Michelle Thomson (Edinburgh West)
PLAID CYMRU – 3
Jonathan Edwards (Carmarthen East and Dinefwr)
Liz Saville Roberts (Dwyfor Meirionnydd)
Hywel Williams (Arfon)
The 51 SNP MPs who voted against Brexit are probably a lost cause and best dealt with by sorting out the mess which Blair created in creating the Scottish Parliament. This needs to be a UKIP policy; the gross ove-representation of the SNP in the HoC is undemocratic.
Mr Place,
I fully agree with your last paragraph.
I think the party is concentrating far too much on how many seats we may, or may not, take from Labour (or Conservative) at the next General Election.
What on earth would be the point of getting, say, double figure MPs (as our new leader says he wants), or even more, if by then we have already left the EU on a soft Brexit deal.
We’re always being portrayed as a ‘one policy’ party and I think it is imperative that we should live up to that name, at least for the next two years or so. Concentrate on nothing else but making sure our country has an absolute clean break from the European Union in its entirety.
Let people say we’re no more than a pressure group. What does it matter? We’re doing this for our country.
So, come on UKIP, do nothing else but shout Brexit, Brexit, Brexit from the rooftops until we’re properly out of this corrupt set-up.
Do it for your country and the 17.4 million people who voted Leave and, who knows, the voters may just thank you at the next General Election.
I live in hope!
Bit of over-analysis going on here – KISS.
Of course we have to be as vocal as possible on the chicanery on Brexit – not easy when the etsablishment press are always trying to marginalise and dismiss us. The way to get their attention is to be radical and imaginative. We should go on the offensive and proclaim our negotiation position – that we should leave the EU and reclaim our territorial waters on 1 January, that if they put tariffs up then so will we, that all other co-operative arrangements will remain in place unless and until they end them. The only thing that does require negotiation is UK-funded pension arrangements, but that shouldn’t be too difficult. Simple. WE take the initiative with something that will appeal strongly to enormous numbers of people. Everything else is handwringing for the pussyfoots, haymaking for Bremoaners and dancing to Brussels’ tune. It would be good politics too, wrongfooting both Tories and Labour.
The other thing we should do, which is not mutually exclusive but complementary, is get our policy direction decided, and quickly. If we – rightly – identify that it’s Labour voters we need to appeal to most, then we’d better start offering policies which will attract them more but also appeal to middle earners. It can and must be done if we are to succeed.
Q – as always, wonderful and how I would love to see it done…but is anyone out there listening?
I too am in despair that the Remainers message is not being combated.
I fear that where UKIP was once unafraid to incite and give voice to the anger of True Brits, it has now become a party desperate to be loved and seen as mainstream – and sorry Viv if you think this is sniping or carping – but I have to say what I think.
Why was the recently proposed march cancelled? On Breitbart people were willing to come from all corners of the country, and bring their families. But there was no support or advertisement from UKIP, perhaps the time wasn’t ideal, but something must be done, even if it comes to having to battle the Remainers on the streets, and I’m sure we would have to, I think if we don’t demonstrate our anger soon it will be too late.
Now I realize to my chagrin that it’s easy for me to say, because my circumstances are such that I cannot support a march in person, but heavens how I wish I could!
Please please Mr. Nuttall bring in J RE who has, or had (some have left in disgust in the way young people do!) but he still has many followers who will do the biz online and he would be unafraid to lead a huge contingent to Westminster.
I know it will help enormously if Victoria Ayling gets elected, but on its own that isn’t enough, and we need to do more. The anger out there is massive, we need to channel it now – the whole country is waiting for UKIP to give them a lead, give them a platform, you won’t get votes in the North by appearing on HIGNFY – shortly people, especially the fishing community, just won’t vote at all in the next GE, if they continue to be, as they see it, let down.
I only wish the Leadership would read what has been said so far on here, but of course they don’t, which is why Q’s suggestion for UKIP Daily to be the forum that our leaders had to answer to was such a good one.
Apologies for this rant, thank heavens there is somewhere I can let off steam!
Dee,
Tell me when and where a demo is to be held and I will be there.
Dear DD – I wish…..
Tomorrow evening there is a presentation at UCL ‘The democratic duty to appose Brexit’ Anyone fancy coming along? Entrance is free, it will be interesting to see what the pretty young things have got to say, and then shoot them down in flames don’t you think?
Anyone out there that wants to come? Tomorrow is your chance to get among the young clever bods and teach them a thing or two, or at least to listen to their absurd deluded chants. Hopefully it will not be too confrontational!
D D that’s a positive for living in London, if you are going, please report on here how it goes (take notebook and a very sharp pencil!). But take care.
Sorry, no, DD. Apart from the cost and inconvenience of travelling 240 miles to London, I would find it torture to listen to some deluded know-nothing, know-it-alls squeak about why it is their ‘democratic duty to oppose Brexit’.
The very title of this debate shows they have no idea what ‘democracy’ means and have made their minds up about it anyway.
Well, I am going to be chief ‘heckler’ just like that howler outside the Supreme Court, I think I will take a megaphone just to make sure I am heard!
Great idea to persuade the party leaders to read UKIPdaily (which leader in their right mind wouldn’t?) but they could also comment and tell us what they are doing to make UKIP a force to be reckoned with.
David,
Yes David. I don’t know about you but my pitchfork is ready and waiting for action.
DD,
You need have no doubts about me.
Well said Dee – we need people of your spirit!
Thanks for your kind words.
Stephen, I think you’re right to be concerned and you’re certainly not alone there but I don’t think the ukip 2015 manifesto is anything like good enough for the challenge that lies ahead. Nor frankly the Party while it awaits a “refreshed” NEC and shows significant signs of relying on the same management structure that has so comprehensively failed to engage with its own membership previously.
It is also true that getting the likes of Gerrard Batten involved again is encouraging and the leadership team need time to make their mark, so we have to wait but actions like putting Suzanne Evans on HIGNFY is foolish frivolity beyond belief.
While I’m starting to think we’ve all been wasting our time, I’m also wondering how, in a perfect world, I could put a strong enough case across to this constituency’s electorate, if and when the opportunity arises, because I took on Farron last time around, at very short notice, and I will get the opportunity to be selected again, should I decide to take it on.
But if so, my feeling is to pull no punches and risk all to expose his malignancy. And the once Conservative Party now stuffed with career orientated remainers. We are not the Party of extremism yet that is how were are painted.
In the thread “Richmond by-election” (4th December) I exchanged emails with Ajax of this parish, wondering what chinks to highlight in the Farron armoury. You will find his reply there which is to highlight the aspects that Ajax describes as cultural Marxism and avoid the religious equality attack. Then yesterday or so, the carefully worded by hard hitting report came out about the penetration of Muslim extremism, separation and ghettoisation.
I’m starting to wonder whether we ukip “activiststs” should do the same. Maybe through this site or something like it. That builds a campaign plan, per constituency or sub region or party opponent or subject that accurately reflects their degree of difference with true UKIP position from the malignant establishment position.
Then publicise it. As it grows. Offer it to JRE or Breitbart for publicity. To give it legs. And to fight fire with fire.
Here my relevant opponents would be a conservative and Farron. I am a UKIP conservative (and ex local activist). But I’m described by SE as far right, which I totally reject by the way, because I think UKIP’s greatest strength is support from both sides, harking back to an era we’ve lived through, which was safer then and could become so again.
But while I’m no Enoch Powell, I wonder how his message would be received today? I don’t just mean rivers of blood. I mean more his support for commonwealth, values, democracy and integrity that was swept away so ruthlessly almost 50 years ago.
Maybe it’s time to sweep it back? Realising that it will provoke howls of outrage from our enemies if his name is invoked. Or in the name of the gender based slavery and religioun based mysogyny than the report highlights. Or the Glasgow Muslim murdered last year by another Muslim for wishing his customers a happy Easter. Did the report mention that I wonder?
Maybe the electorate are more ready to question the howls of outrage now, than the message.? Maybe the way to fight now is to incite rather than debate? Hit the hot buttons, throw political petrol on the flames and let our enemies tie themselves in knots. Even the leadership airheads who think the answer lies in appearances on HIGNFY.
I simply offer the thought to this site, for debate, or dismissal.
Alan: What does Farron mean when he says he believes in ‘religious equality’? That all religions are equally good, therefore equally acceptable? This is not true: anyone with a modicum of knowledge and intelligence can perceive the difference between a repressive, coercive religion and a tolerant, non-coercive one. (Anyone who witters on about how Christanity USED TO BE intolerant and coercive should pull their wits together and remember that as an advanced nation we managed to separate Church and State long ago and, with the aid of science, broke the grip of the Church on the people. In other words, that was THEN and this is NOW and NOW is all that matters.)
Is Farron saying that all religions have equal legal rights to proselytise their ‘faith’ and vigorously recruit members? Would he be happy if that notorious cult The Scientologists arrived in his constituency and started brainwashing the locals?
Does he mean that everyone has an equal right to worship as they please? OK, that’s fine, but does he know that a certain religion does not allow its adherents to leave that faith without punishment: ostracism at its mildest, murder of the apostate if it can be got away with, as set down in its ‘holy book’? So, if islam itself denies equality of rights, why should it be granted them?
Does Farron mean by ‘religious equality’ that islam should be recognised legally as being on an equal footing in this country with Christianity, the foundation of our laws and values, the religion of the Established Church with the Queen at its head?
This is the most dangerous idea of all and if silly Timmy really thinks this, he needs exposing as the naive fool he is.
If Farron was my opponent, I would want him to explain clearly and in detail what he means by ‘religious equality’ and allow no libdem fuzziness or fudge on this particular ‘virtue-signalling’ platitude.
Slovakia recently passed a law forbidding islam to be recognised as a national religion. They had very good reason to do so, and we have an even bigger one.
As we have a bigger reason Islam should be proscribed and measures put in place, with suitable penalties, to ensure that it is.
Of course that would sensibly require the confiscation of all mosques and their demolition. A side benefit would be the elimination of the early morning wailing which emanates from them.
Don’t disagree with you, David, and it may come to that at some future date if the PTB don’t extract their heads from their fundaments and start doing what needs to be done now, steadily and firmly. In this country, the political class has had a knack in the past of avoiding revolutions and uprisings by realising the danger that lies ahead and taking steps to release the pressure and prevent a blow-up. Have they lost that knack when it comes to dealing with an importunate alien culture in our country? Because it seems to me that they are still busy trying to suppress negative reaction to it, but that tactic will eventually fail.
Flyer,
You are not alone in your decision to come back and lend a hand. Hopefully there are many more of us of the same mind. We could sell raffle tickets for pulling the lever too; I’m sure that they would sell out quickly.
UKIP fundraiser!
Let’s hope we don’t have to resort to civil unrest, but if needs be……….
My feeling is that the EU will have to be rid of us now, it can only survive by further political integration with its members and they’ll never sell it to the UK now we’ve voted to leave. We’re just a thorn in their side now, at least that’s what I’m hoping.
I haven’t set foot in my native country for many years, if it comes to civil unrest though I’ve decided to come back and lend a hand. If we have to string anybody up? I’d like to volunteer my services to be the one to pull the lever on Blair.