Ed ~ Viv’s “Daily Brexit Betrayal” will be back tomorrow, usual time, usual place.
It would appear to me that the two-party system in Parliament is in the process of being destroyed, mainly by Brexit. By a distinct majority, voters decided in the referendum three years ago that we should leave the European Union. But it wasn’t a unanimous decision. There was a significant minority who wanted to stay in the bloc, and that minority is furious that it lost the referendum.
It is now demanding a ‘People’s vote’, a second referendum, confirmatory ballot, losers’ vote or call it whatever you like, in an effort to stop the Brexit process and in the hope that voters in the UK will have changed their minds; at least some senior Remainers are freely admitting that. However, whenever a Remainer is interviewed, he or she tends to claim that the country is coming round to their way of thinking, although how they know, that is never made clear.
But a second referendum will not work, mainly because whichever side loses will demand yet another vote, the best of three or the best of five, and if the Leave side wins again, a demand will be made for the original vote to be observed. The only way a definitive argument could be made is if the Leave side, not Remain, won by a landslide. That might shut the Remainers up for a while, but I doubt it will be permanent.
Then there’s the question of the question. The only possible question I might support is exactly the same as the 2016 referendum, but with the Remainers arguing that we didn’t know what we were voting for then, I doubt if that will satisfy them a second time.
Should it be a three-way referendum – Leave under WTO, Leave with the WAB or Remain? I watched Suzanne Evans as the EU results came in on Sunday evening and as Emily Thornberry suggested this, Suzanne said that would split the vote. “Oh no,” she said. “We’re wise to that one.”
I’m not sure I agree with her as I think the WAB has been so totally discredited nobody in their right minds would vote for it. Such is my opinion and readers of this site may agree with me, but perhaps Mr & Mrs Joe Public might be tempted to vote for it just to get the matter done and dusted, which is what many people are keen on.
In her time as Prime Minister, Theresa May has always been adamant that there won’t be a second referendum and whereas some might call her pig-headed and stubborn, I have to respect her for sticking to that decision. I think she’s right. (It’s about the only thing she got right!)
But there is still a seismic shift in British politics. On the Remain side, we’ve seen a surge in support for the LibDems and Greens, and the formation of a new party, CHUK, which has drawn support from both Conservatives and Labour.
On the Leave side, both of the two main political parties in the House of Commons are split, with members on both sides supporting Leave. And of course, The Brexit Party has surged into a commanding lead at the polls. Nigel has said the party would do just as well in a General Election, and although I would imagine the EU elections have shown a protest vote, he may well be right.
However, there is no way the government will go for a General Election under the new leader, although the Opposition will be screaming for it. The incoming Prime Minister will see that he/she could lose a significant number of MPs. With the Brexit question polarising the country, there will be Leave areas which will not return a Remain MP.
Nigel has said that if we’re not out by October 31, he’ll stand The Brexit Party in the next General Election. But he may have to wait three years for it, until 2022, and an awful lot can happen in the meantime.
With the results of the European elections coming in, it seems that the EU is split in very similar ways. Groups like the Eurosceptic Europe for Freedom and Direct Democracy on one side and pro-European Alliance of Liberals and Democrats for Europe and the European People’s Party are both doing well. I am firmly convinced that the bloc won’t be here for much longer. Unfortunately, the volatile Europeans may resort to violent revolution to get rid of their masters.
It’ll be interesting to see what our new clutch of MEPs do in Brussels, especially with the majority of them Brexiteers. Farage has promised to cause havoc in the debating chamber, with moves like refusing to agree the budget and voting down other essential legislation.
Nigel and his cohorts have suggested they could cause absolute mayhem in Europe, although I’m sure there would be a temptation for him to look at the huge salary afforded to the President and muse on whether it’s worth making lots of waves and ‘going native’ as some UKIP MEPs have done.
I wonder if there is any mechanism for the EU to decide to eject a member state …
It’s a pity that UKIP was very thoroughly trounced, following the party’s successes five years ago. It is now obvious that there was a crying need for a champion to accede to the results of the referendum and take us out of the EU.
And it is such a shame that Gerard Batten didn’t grasp the opportunity that Farage has taken.
It was always a ‘given’ that The Brexit Party would do well at these EuroParl Elections, after all look at how well UKIP did in 2014.
Voters are happier at these elections to vote ‘differently’ as there is no risk of either of the main parties losing their grip on power at Westminster.
The real ‘acid-test’ of whether things are going to change will be at the Peterborough by-election next week, where TBP are standing a candidate.
Although an area that voted ‘Leave’ in 2016, it is also an area that is happy to vote in Labour.
It remains to be seen whether voters there will go back to their traditional tribal voting patterns, or whether they’ll be brave enough to go out and vote for TBP again.
Well I’ve just decided to renew my membership of UKIP it’s all about democracy.
Going right back to the “main” article and its reference to the possibility of a second referendum, it is important to analyse the tactics of the Remain fraternity in this matter.
Clearly this grouping is hoping that if a second referendum can be foisted on the country, the result would swing in an anti-Brexit direction and the idea of Brexit can be put to bed.
The ardent Leavers seem happy that the result of 2016 would be repeated but are rightly incensed that a second referendum would be a disregard for the original promises made when the referendum was announced.But incensed is not enough!!!
Nevertheless a second referendum seems likely and the Political Elite and the MSM have for months been preparing the ground for this and surreptitiously trying to persuade the Leave voters to change sides.
Every article/broadcast regarding a no-deal Brexit is qualified as “crashing out of the EU”, being a disaster for the UK economy, being something that “no-one” wants, being an outcome only being pursued by “hardline” Brexiteers etc. When these comments are voiced on the TV, Radio or the MSM the comments are not challenged and no alternative view of the benefits of Brexit are permitted. The public are therefore being indoctrinated into believing this to be the inevitable outcome of leaving the EU without a deal.
Unless the vocal Leave supporters (MP’s, Business Owners, Economists and the like) are able to regain the initiative and forcefully question the pessimistic Brexit views being daily pushed into the public domain, the wavering Leavers will take the view that they will change their vote or decline to vote in a second referendum.
The wording of the articles and statements being put forward by the Remaining Elite are not casual “off the cuff” comments but a carefully and coordinated plan to seed doubt into the minds of those who voted to leave.
It is being maintained by Remainers that a vote to remain would be the safe position of status quo. No one is expounding the horrors of the onward march of the Federal Europe we would be locked into. Our involvement in the EU Army, the ever increasing overpowering regulations, the anti trade and diminishing share of world trade, the lack of democracy, the need to eventually join the Euro etc etc.
Who will take the mantle to challenge the pessimistic propaganda???
You’re absolutely correct, David, and it is their hold on the mainstream media that allows the Remainers to do this. I have tried to counter the ‘crash-out’ wordage by branding our relationship with the EU as being ‘shackled’ as though is a bad thing, along the same lines as ‘crashing out’ is considered a bad thing. We also need to promote the good things like ‘freedom’ and ‘independence’ that Brexit will bring.
It is unfortunate that the MSM are all Remainers and their attitude needs to be challenged in the courts, but that costs money. I know our Leave parties of all colours keep sending us requests for contributions but we’re not all made of money!
We can send letters on the subject to the MSM but unless our opinions fall into line with theirs, they probably won’t publish us.
As Viv says, Keep B*ggering On!
If the Brexit Party had not stood in the EU Elections then, as the only substantive ‘leave’ option on the ballot paper, UKIP would no doubt have done well.The polls showed UKIP rising steadily into double figures and that trend must have continued in the absence of any other viable Brexit alternative to eventually yield a respectable result.
And Gerard Batten would not have had to put up with criticism, much of it ill-considered and undeserved, that has come his way..
But The Brexit Part did stand; So we are where we are; still here, determined and ready to carry on fighting the unavoidable battles..
Carl Benjamin sums things up rather well:
So good. He is spot on!
Thanks for posting it.
Howard,
I hope that UKIP get the leader who will facilitate Carl’s objectives.
UKIP have a vacancy for deputy leader,
Richard Braine has the positive outlook that UKIP needs, he is confident / polite and does not
get defensive when being questioned on the usual “stuff ” in fact he seems to enjoy the challenge.
Just a thought Gerard.
Richard Braine on Talk radio: “does UKIP have a future”.
https://youtu.be/HmaL0o9BYvY
WHAT ????
He’s part of the Tommy Robinson love- cult.
All a bit quasi -Nazi fetish. Not a good look.
Tommy Robinson campaigned against UKIP. Read that AGAIN
Tommy Robinson campaigned against UKIP. Read that AGAIN
If I were leader I would be compelled to expel Richard Braine.
And all the others like him.
Unfortunate, as he’s a pleasant fellow, well educated and a good communicator.
But he has the Tommy obsession that has fecked UKIP with the voters.
So…..
NO.
Kevin,
Tommy Robinson, certainly does continually preoccupy YOUR mind.
Is this not an unhealthy obsession ?
Think there is a general tone, ‘this was a disaster for UKIP.’ Now, while I don’t deny the thrust of that, it’s not really as bad as it may seem:
1 – As Tory and Labour voters have lent there vote to the Brexit Party (and the Lib Dems) maybe something similar has happened with UKIP?
2 – Before the Brexit Party was properly launched, UKIP were polling around 11%. That represents a positive rebound from the dark days of early 2018.
3 – These EU elections seem to about ‘protest’ votes, polarising into Brexit and Remain (Lib Dems).
4 – There is no doubt that Nigel Farage is the leading politician of our times. However, he was UKIP’s biggest asset and it’s worst liability. As Viv stated, so able in speaking. However, I don’t think he was ever a proper leader (enabling and leading others, not just inspiring them by his own example).
5 – How anyone can support a party while having no say, beats me. Who would want that? Not very democratic is it? Who elects the next leader (of the Brexit Party) and who chooses the candidates for elections?
6 – Let’s hope that this movement leads to a break-down of the 2-party system and a really good PR system in it’s place. It’s possible to get nearly 100% representation. That will mean more smaller parties with distinct policies. Also, less power for the whips. Probably will also mean the end of the Brexit Party, it’s job done and it’s policy destroying it!
7 – UKIP still has 30k members, proper governance and a proper manifesto of policies.
Interesting times indeed….!
They’ve just had it EU election still got beaten giveit up you’ve LOST
Who are you talking to?
Farage at the moment is in the ascendant but how long will it last,his party has supporters not members,so they can give their money but have no say in the party. In time splits will appear between all the different groups within it,just like has happened with UKIP,but I think it will happen a lot,lot quicker plus you can bet that the MSM will be busy trawling through the past of its MEPs and any one else standing for the party….we do live in interesting political times but change is in the air not only here but across Europe,where though will it lead us,that is the question.
There is a fear that the “irresistible force” of popular opinion now building up in the EU will not have the stamina to defeat the “immovable object” of the EU globalist elite. This fear may be justified when those of us with long memories think of what happened to John.F. and Robert Kennedy and the State of American politics today.
Let’s be honest Debbie, in Gerard Batten’s defence, he wasn’t invited on to the tv or radio until very recently whereas Farage has been on the country’s leading talk radio station several nights a week for the last few years. If Batten had had that exposure he would have got the support and he could have spoken about Islam at the same time. It would have been great,
I agree Sean. Batten wasn’t on TV as much as Farage but why was that? The media love someone who is as outspoken as Farage, and Batten just isn’t.
In journalism we have what are called ‘rent-a-quote’ people – those who we call up if we want a good quote. These people are likely to use expressive language, even possibly inflamatory language, and it all makes for good copy. Farage is one of such people; Batten is not. Batten may be a steady, hard-working leader, but he doesn’t have as much media presence as Farage. Fact of life, I’m afraid.
Hi Debbie. Thats not the main reason, but it is a contributory factor.
This is incorrect. Batten REFUSED to speak to LBC or to SKY in latter days. One must not run away from people like Nick Ferrari who has the highest rating breakfast show on radio.
Farage was pulled off air, fairly, by Global /LBC in line with Section 6 of the OFCOM regulations as soon as the EU election was certain to happen and the LBC balance from that moment onwards was absolutely fair.
I know, because I monitored it.
Politicians seeking public office need to understand that it is essential they engage with journalists whose job (and public duty) it is to ask awkward questions and seek answers.
If we had had a leader who with good grace could take some on the chin, have the humility to admit mistakes and to learn from them, then UKIP would not be where it is today.
I squirmed ( and had a lot of sympathy for ) Mike Hookem when he was pressed on the usual Islam issue and was forced to publicly state he disagreed with his own leader . HE SHOULD NEVER have been put in that position. Mike was right to resign.
Freddy had a similar problem on the BBC with Victoria Derbyshire asking about the Carl Benjamin disaster. Freddy handled it very differently and well and refused to defend the indefensible.
We learn, or die.
Having to continually discuss supporting people like T.Robinson and C.Benjamin, who are quite capable of ruining their own reputations, was a totally unneeded distraction from real issues.
Regarding Theresa May, this is an interesting video, I’m not saying it’s completely accurate but there is a certain amount of truth in it, I’ve been following the story for months and this is just an easy way to illustrate it. It may be tempting to dismiss this as fake news but I don’t think it is, things could be about to get more interesting than they already are.
WARNING: URGENT MESSAGE TO THE UK!!!
WHY THERESA MAY REALLY RESIGNED
https://youtu.be/7lUx1yVeAy8
The video just lists announcements Flyer. I don’t see ‘The Americans are coming’ as a particular threat although it would be interesting to learn more, as long as there is support for these allegations. And I don’t see the answer to ‘Why Theresa May really resigned’. If there is proof I’d like to see it but as it is, it’s just hearsay. Fake news? Could easily be.
I’ve been following this for months from a variety of different sources and I wouldn’t think for one minute that the Americans are coming but the en coulisse (as Viv would say) political fallout could be interesting.
We’ve been living in wild times politically both here and in the US because of the Left simply refusing to accept democratic decisions with Brexit and the US presidential election, this is unheard of stuff and there was always going to be more to this than met the eye.
The Russia collussion hoax was criminal behavior and the UK press reported on how MI5/6 were desperate for trump not to declassify this information but now he has and it appears that it was initiated by Christopher Steel an ex MI6 spy, you can bet your life that we’re still only seeing the tip of the iceberg. The other thing is that some of this leads to the Clintons, Uranium One and much other corruption.
The video is just a convenient and easy way to draw attention, I’ve followed this story for long enough to know there’s something in it and even if we never get to hear the whole truth, things could be about to get interesting. We live in mad times politically and it’s not over yet.
Donald Trump has had enough and he’s not the sort of guy to take this stuff lying down, he’s going to have his pound of flesh one way or another. Good on him, I say.
Flyer, perhaps you might like to turn your attention to what lurks beneath in the not so innocent The Brexit Party
I have been calling it Nigel’s Ego Party and, since he openly left – lying about his reasons for why loud and clear (but telling the truth to Edward Malnick for the Sunday Telegraph) it is – on the surface at least – just that. When the useful idiot has served their purpose the real reason behind its existence may emerge and, if our members heed the sirens cooing ‘UKIP is dead in the water’ it will be too late.
The MSM and usual suspects missed a trick when the sent the Electoral Commission in to pore over its books. They looked under the wrong stone where the slime is lurking. Do the maths as they say – 100,000 x £25 – and some, when there were extra donations to spite those who sent in the forensic accountants (although a really serious forensic accountant might dig up something useful – on who underwrites it for instance and from when)
Catherine (Hell hath no fury) Blaiklock set it up in November after Gerard treated her like s-. But …. who had she been in communication with? Very clever name, although Freddy says if she’d been really clever she’d have missed out The so it came top of the ballot. Rumours were that Liar Farage was thinking about teaming up with Bonker (perhaps that’s why he bothered to set up Our Nation) – he wouldn’t have got half as far with that.
All the known saboteurs from UKIP are now in his Ego Party – how many were lurking before he even left us.
Helena – as I’ve posted elsewhere, democracy for us voters these days seems to have become all about choosing the least worst option, sort of like choosing your favourite disease.
The fact that the electorate are so desperate for change that they’d go out en mass and vote for a six week old party with no policies of manifesto is a sad sign of the times.
I just hope that when we’ve punished and destroyed the LibLabCon and left the EU, we can return to some form of stable, representative government (I’m not sure if we’ve ever had it in the first place).
What are the Brexit party going to do when we’ve left the EU? Change their name to the Conservatives?
I’m not happy about all of this either, there’s so much corruption, dishonesty and deceit in politics that I just don’t trust anyone anymore.
I agree with a lot of what you are saying (and I respect you immensely as probably the best writer on this site and as a superb and tenacious activist).
However, I reckon that the day will come when UKIP and TBP will have to come to some form of accommodation rather than hack at each other and split the votes in winnable areas.
Our problem is EGO. Farage and Batten loathed each other. Farage can’t be kingpin and get solid UKIP support. Gerard has fallen.
Make way for a new leader. A new way.
We must elect a leader who is not only capable of uniting disparate factions in the Brexit family ( any parties ) but also someone clubbable enough to be the face of reasoned and seasoned Brexiteers when confronted by the MSM and hostile third parties.
Thats a tough job spec.
There is no man or woman out there for that task that can do the job without the consensus of our membership.
The next leader has to be found by consensus. By common agreement.
Let’s all debate that right now.
There is not much time.
K
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